a disputed conversion to islam

I wish to highlight a blog entry by GuiloStories. In a nutshell (and according to her and the family) one of her relatives passed away. His eldest son turned up from nowhere declaring that his father who had passed on was in fact a Muslim, having converted to Islam sometime back. This eldest son converted to Islam a few years ago. The Syariah court declared that the deceased was a Muslim, and the body should be buried according to Muslim traditions. Read on…

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Justice and Fair play for the family of Gan Eng Gor (deceased)

1. Our father was seventy-four (74) years old. He suffered a severe stroke in 2006. He was immobilized, bedridden, mentally unsound, cannot speak, partially deaf and has very poor vision.

2. We transferred him to stay with one of our brothers in Klang. Our aged mother looked after, bathed and fed him. She also helped to look after our nephews and nieces.

3. Our father died on 20th Jan 2008. As Gan Hock Seng (the eldest son) is a member of the family, we informed him of our father’s death. He was then told us that our father is a muslim, we were shocked and did not believed him. So we continue to perform the wake service as our father have never led a muslim life. The Majlis Agama officers came and attempted to snatch the dead body, all our family members more shocked and angry, we resisted and strongly protested against the removal of our father’s body.

4. We obtained his alleged conversion papers from Majlis Agama the second day.

5. We were advised by our solicitors that there are serious irregularities in the said conversion papers especially the Declaration of Conversion into Islam.

a). The declaration was before a Pegawai Ukhuwah. His rubber stamp was on the paper but that officer did not sign.

b). Further there was no signatory at the certification column.

c). There was an illegal alteration on the date to 3rd July 2007.

d). The thumb?print was questionable as we are certain that our deceased father was in Klang and not at the address No. 451, Taman Megaway, 70400 Sikamat, Seremban as stated in the application form.

e). His address stated in the Borang Perakuan Memeluk Islam is No: 1272, Jalan TBK 6/2, Taman Bkt Kepayang, 70200 Seremban, the residence of the eldest son. We wish to state that our father has never resided at this address.

f). The Majlis Agama Authorities claimed that our deceased father made an oral declaration in Arabic accepting the Muslim faith. Our family has medical confirmations from three doctors that our father was unable to speak.

g). We were asked to appear before the Syariah Court Seremban, we believe the Syariah Court is for Muslims only.

h). We refused to attend at the Syariah Court on a matter of principle as non?Muslims. We refused to submit to the jurisdiction of the Syariah Court.

i). The Syariah Court made a unilateral declaration that our father is a Muslim and is to be buried in accordance to Muslim rites.

j). We filed an application at the High Court Seremban to adjudicate on the validity, authenticity,veracity and legality of the conversion paper especially the declaration of acceptance into Islam.

k). The High Court Seremban dismissed our application on the ground that he has no jurisdiction to hear this matter as the subject matter falls within the purview of the Syariah Court. We beg to differ.

l). We were indeed shocked and aggrieved at the simplistic way the High Court disposed off this matter. We only seek justice, fair play and to find out the truth on his alleged conversion.

10. The eldest son Gan Hock Seng converted to Islam years ago. Our father and mother had strenuously opposed his conversion.

11. This eldest son had allegedly converted our father without the knowledge of our mother and all other seven siblings.

12. Further, the eldest son had NEVER taken care of him physically and financially. He hardly visited him too.

13. Even if the eldest son had converted our father, we like to ask :
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i). Why is it that he did not take care of him and brought him to stay in his house to lead a Muslim life?

ii). Why did he allow our father to continue living in a non-muslim home in Klang? Our father had never prayed and continued eating pork and other non?halal food. He never revealed to anyone that he has converted to Islam.

iii). Why he as a Muslim, did not ensure that our father (if he had been indeed converted) led a Muslim life ?

iv). Why is it that the Agama Islam authorities did not visit and follow up with our father – the alleged new convert, after his conversion?

14. We believe we have been unfairly treated by our eldest brother and the Agama Islam authorities in this alleged conversion of our father. If there had been a conversion, we firmly believe that the Agama Islam authorities should have informed all members of the family. There should not be a fight over the body of dead person. There should be dignity and respect on the dead person.

15. We hope the PM and the higher ups in the Islamic Authorities review this case and to ensure that the truth is unraveled. We hope that all conversions to Islam is fair and transparent and made known to all the next of kin of the convert.

We Seek Justice, Fair play and Truth in this matter.

From,
Gan Hok Ming for and on behalf of the family members of Gan Eng Gor (deceased)
Date: 25th January 2008

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My colleague who is a Muslim told me that even if both the father and son are Muslims, the distribution of the deceased properties and monies will be conducted according to his will. He’s not sure about the part if the deceased did not leave a will, but he is of the opinion that all properties and monies will be distributed evenly to the deceased’s family, regardless of religion.

But I guess that the main issue is the family wants a Buddhist/ Taoist funeral for the deceased. Reverse the situation: hypothetically if the whole family are Muslims, and the eldest son converts to Buddhism (or any other religion), and decided to claim his father as having converted to Buddhism before he passed on, and wants him to be buried as a Buddhist, I think that the eldest son is full of shit.

All orthodox religions expounds on the important of filial piety. My colleague just related a tale to me, that he cannot remember in full, but he managed to google it, and here it is:

KISAH PEMUDA BERIBU-BAPAKAN BABI (Source)

Nabi Musa adalah satu-satunya Nabi yang boleh bercakap terus dengan Allah S.W.T Setiap kali dia hendak bermunajat, Nabi Musa akan naik ke Bukit Tursina. Di atas bukit itulah dia akan bercakap dengan Allah.Nabi Musa sering bertanya dan Allah akan menjawab pada waktu itu juga. Inilah kelebihannya yang tidak ada pada nabi-nabi lain.

Suatu hari Nabi Musa telah bertanya kepada Allah. “Ya Allah, siapakah orang di syurga nanti yang akan berjiran dengan aku?”.

Allah pun menjawab dengan mengatakan nama orang itu, kampung serta tempat tinggalnya. Setelah mendapat jawapan, Nabi Musa turun dari Bukit Tursina dan terus berjalan mengikut tempat yang diberitahu. Setelah beberapa hari di dalam perjalanan akhirnya sampai juga Nabi Musa ke tempat berkenaan.

Dengan pertolongan beberapa orang penduduk di situ, beliau berjaya bertemu dengan orang tersebut. Setelah memberi salam beliau dipersilakan masuk dan duduk di ruang tamu.

Tuan rumah itu tidak melayan Nabi Musa. Dia masuk ke dalam bilik dan melakukan sesuatu di dalam. Sebentar kemudian dia keluar sambil membawa seekor babi betina yang besar. Babi itu didukungnya dengan cermat. Nabi Musa terkejut melihatnya. “Apa hal ini?, kata Nabi Musa berbisik dalam hatinya penuh keheranan.

Babi itu dibersihkan dan dimandikan dengan baik. Setelah itu babi itu dilap sampai kering serta dipeluk cium kemudian dihantar semula ke dalam bilik. Tidak lama kemudian dia keluar sekali lagi dengan membawa pula seekor babi jantan yang lebih besar. Babi itu juga dimandikan dan dibersihkan. Kemudian dilap hingga kering dan dipeluk serta cium dengan penuh kasih sayang. Babi itu kemudiannya dihantar semula ke bilik.

Selesai kerjanya barulah dia melayan Nabi Musa. “Wahai saudara! Apa agama kamu?”. “Aku agama Tauhid”, jawab pemuda itu iaitu agama Islam. “Habis, mengapa kamu membela babi? Kita tidak boleh berbuat begitu.” Kata Nabi Musa.

“Wahai tuan hamba”, kata pemuda itu. “Sebenarnya kedua babi itu adalah ibubapa kandungku. Oleh kerana mereka telah melakukan dosa yang besar, Allah telah menukarkan rupa mereka menjadi babi yang hodohrupanya. Soal dosa mereka dengan Allah itu soal lain. Itu urusannya dengan Allah. Aku sebagai anaknya tetap melaksanakan kewajipanku sebagai anak. Hari-hari aku berbakti kepada kedua ibubapaku sepertimana yang tuan hamba lihat tadi. Walaupun rupa mereka sudah menjadi babi, aku tetap melaksanakan tugasku.”, sambungnya.

“Setiap hari aku berdoa kepada Allah agar mereka diampunkan. Aku bermohon supaya Allah menukarkan wajah mereka menjadi manusia yang sebenar, tetapi Allah masih belum memakbulkan lagi.”, tambah pemuda itu lagi.

Maka ketika itu juga Allah menurunkan wahyu kepada Nabi Musa a.s. ‘Wahai Musa, inilah orang yang akan berjiran dengan kamu di Syurga nanti, hasil baktinya yang sangat tinggi kepada kedua ibubapanya. Ibubapanya yang sudah buruk dengan rupa babi pun dia berbakti juga. Oleh itu Kami naikkan maqamnya sebagai anak soleh disisi Kami.”

Allah juga berfirman lagi yang bermaksud : “Oleh kerana dia telah berada di maqam anak yang soleh disisi Kami, maka Kami angkat doanya. Tempat kedua ibubapanya yang Kami sediakan di dalam neraka telah Kami pindahkan ke dalam syurga.”

Itulah berkat anak yang soleh. Doa anak yang soleh dapat menebus dosa ibubapa yang akan masuk ke dalam neraka pindah ke syurga. Ini juga hendaklah dengan syarat dia berbakti kepada ibubapanya. Walaupun hingga ke peringkat rupa ayah dan ibunya seperti babi. Mudah-mudahan ibubapa kita mendapat tempat yang baik di akhirat kelak.

Walau bagaimana buruk sekali pun perangai kedua ibubapa kita itu bukan urusan kita, urusan kita ialah menjaga mereka dengan penuh kasih sayang sebagaimana mereka menjaga kita sewaktu kecil hingga dewasa.

Walau banyak mana sekali pun dosa yang mereka lakukan, itu juga bukan urusan kita, urusan kita ialah meminta ampun kepada Allah S.W.T supaya kedua ibubapa kita diampuni Allah S.W.T.

Doa anak yang soleh akan membantu kedua ibubapanya mendapat tempat yang baik di akhirat, inilah yang dinanti-nantikan oleh para ibubapa di alam kubur.

Erti sayang seorang anak kepada ibu dan bapanya bukan melalui hantaran wang ringgit, tetapi sayang seorang anak pada kedua ibubapanya ialah dengan doanya supaya kedua ibubapanya mendapat tempat yang terbaik di sisi Allah.

Translation (or the gist of it

Nabi Musa (Moses) asked Allah who would be his neighbour in heaven. Allah gave Nabi Musa a man’s name and address. So Nabi Musa went to seek out this future neighbour in heaven, and arrived at the man’s house. Instead of talking to Nabi Musa, the man went into a room and reappeared carefully carrying a sow. He cleaned, bathed and dried the sow with all care and attention, then after giving the sow a hug and a kiss he carried the sow back into the room. After a while, he reappeared again, this time carrying a male pig. The same treatment was given to the male pig, and after all that, the man sat down with Nabi Musa.

Nabi Musa asked him what religion he was, and the man said he was a Muslim. Nabi Musa asked the man why he reared pigs, as Muslims are not allowed to do so. The man explained that the two pigs were actually his birth parents. They had greatly sinned, and Allah turned them into pigs. However their sin is their business with Allah. “I still have my responsibilities to my parents as their son. Hence I still care for them and take good care of them everyday. I pray to Allah that He would reinstate my parents to their former selves, but He has yet to grant my prayers, ” he said.

At that moment, Allah said to Nabi Musa, “This is the man who will be your neighbour in heaven. Because of his filial piety, he will be given a place in heaven, as will his parents who will be raised to heaven from hell.”

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Or something like that. My translation skills need improving, but I hope that you get the gist of what I am trying to convey. In Buddhism, there is the story of Moggallana which you can read here and here. There is also the Filial Piety Sutra, beginning with a story of how Gautama bowed to a pile of human bones in reverence, prompting his faithful student Ananda to ask him why.

So if what the family of the deceased Gan Eng Gor said are true, well maybe there is a question of why the High Court and Syariah Court handed out the decisions as they did.

As for the eldest son… your mother is still alive, you know.

comments

Comments

  1. Just a minor nit-pick here regarding your translation of the Moses story.

    Nabi Musa asked him what religion he was, and the man said he was a Muslim.

    Actually, Tauhid is not Islam. This is technically and historically impossible (if you choose to take the issue of religion “as is” that is) because Islam hasn’t came into existance during Moses’ (or Musa’s, or whatever you wish to call the prophet who can split seas) time.

    Tauhid generally means “faith”. In this context, it means “person of the book”, ie. Taurat (or torah – ie. Moses’ “book”) or whatever “book” it was from the previous prophet.

    Mind you, I’m no religious scholar and what I’ve written above might be total hogwash (although I strongly doubt it is).

    Anyway, back to the topic. Religion is a touchy issue and personally, I find it pretty weird that the government still maintains all these “Majlis Agama” entities.

    Religion is a belief… not fact. Deal with it. And let families deal with their own tragedies as they see fit.

  2. Wah! If my son tried to do this to me, I would turn in my grave and…. and… well, turn in my grave lah.

  3. A similar thing happened in Sydney, when a Muslim taxi driver met an old woman whom he took to the hospital. She was dying [can't remember what of but it took a while], and as she drew near to death the taxi driver started turning up trying to get her to sign documents to say she’d converted to Islam. Her family tried to have the taxi driver thrown out as the old woman was going blind, deaf, and the taxi driver was being a nuisance to her. The taxi driver kept turning up and harassing her.

    Eventually when she died, the taxi driver produced a piece of paper that the old woman had apparently signed when she was blind and hard of hearing. [And she wasn't even her own legal custodian at that stage]. But, the document said she she left all her belongings to the taxi driver [which included quite a considerable sum, and a house etc], and claimed she’d converted to Islam. The family contested this, but the court ruled with the document [as she'd signed it, even though she was blind and deaf at the time, so couldn't have known what she was signing].

    The taxi driver ended up with all her wealth, as well as having her family banned from her funeral. She was apparently a staunch Christian of some denomination [can't remember which now], but she’s buried in the Muslim section of the cemetery.

    Now, I’m not sure about you, but this to me isn’t real conversion. In the case of what happened in Sydney, it seemed a grab by the taxi driver for the ladies money. In the case of this ‘Eldest Son’ thing in Malaysia, it seems he was more trying to ‘pretend’ his father had converted.
    If I was a Muslim, in both these cases I’d be outraged. Like you said, reverse the situation. What if it was a Muslim and a Buddhist, or Christian or Hindu or [insert religion here] pulled these sorts of stunts.

    What’s more, I’m pretty sure real Muslims don’t want non-Muslims taking up the space in their section of the cemetery. Part of the reasons for having all those different sections in the cemeteries is because a lot of different religions don’t like the idea of having their faithful buried next to non-believers. Not that I think it matters, but I’m pretty it would be insulting to those who do think it matters.

  4. “My colleague who is a Muslim told me that even if both the father and son are Muslims, the distribution of the deceased properties and monies will be conducted according to his will.”

    Growing up – I’ve heard a lot of horror stories about how that the above statement is not practiced here. Apparently authorities will come and take everything away no matter how the will is written, if the next of kins are not of the same religion. Not sure if true or not. Just thought I’d share.

    [suan, feel free to edit/delete, scared might be ridiculous insensitive thing to say]

  5. According to Syariah Law on will. Only 1/3 of the estate can be will, the remaining 2/3 have to be distributed according to Syariah law.

  6. “Reverse the situation: hypothetically if the whole family are Muslims, and the eldest son converts to Buddhism (or any other religion), and decided to claim his father as having converted to Buddhism before he passed on, and wants him to be buried as a Buddhist, I think that the eldest son is full of shit.”

    Cannot reverse the situation for this example, if the son “converted” to Buddhism he is automatically an apostate, and subject to death (strictly speaking as per the Koran) or other punishments. Certainly he could never claim his father to be a fellow convert. Small point only, but one which highlights the extreme position of the Islamic religion, as indeed this case does.

  7. RPK wrote about something about religion before “yet another can of worm open”.
    Well…

  8. Suanie, I am quite skeptical Guatama speech inside filial Piety Sutra does happens, since the idea doesn’t fit Mahayana, but more towards Hinayana or even folklore story by the follower. For example, what if the parent are abusive or a worst, a tyrant that make many people suffer? Should the children choose to report them(as in modern day) ? Or assist to end the tyranny ruling (as in the old age) ?

    You can get an answer under Mahayana teaching for such issue. A Zen guru once ask a follower that well verse in many sutra, “what happens before you born?”.

  9. what the heck is majis agama doing till this kind of probs arouse. dont they suppose to have proper way to handle n declare when someone converted their religion. sighhhh!!!! buat keje elok2 laaa weiiii!!!!!!! used better system. think of better systems other than write “muslim” in mykad.

    dear mr Gan Hok Ming..

    just have a lil faith in mahkamah syariah. if u r on the right side u maybe win the case. just prepared with all evidence that ur dad never practices muslim.

  10. One more reason to hate islam and religion in general. The arrogance that abounds in the islamic world can be astonishing and it is not just the ‘lunatic fringe’ but mainstrain, institutionalised islam (the prime example being the existance of shariah courts, of course). Not that muslims have a monopoly on arrogance but it seems to be integral to their religion.

    We are all brought up and encouraged (at least, we infidels are) to respect other people’s faiths but why should we respect the faith that teaches no respect for others’ faiths?

    This story is yet another reason for righteous and just muslims to hang their heads in shame.

  11. That sux.

  12. GOD IS GREAT!
    GOD IS GREAT!
    GOD IS GREAT!
    GOD IS GREAT!
    GOD IS GREAT!
    GOD IS GREAT!
    GOD IS GREAT!

  13. jane abraham says:

    How to Convert to Islam and Become a Muslim

    The steps a person needs to take to accept Islam as his/her religion, enter its fold, and become a Muslim.

    The word “Muslim” means one who submits to the will of God, regardless of their race, nationality or ethnic background. Becoming a Muslim is a simple and easy process that requires no pre-requisites. One may convert alone in privacy, or he/she may do so in the presence of others.

    If anyone has a real desire to be a Muslim and has full conviction and strong belief that Islam is the true religion of God, then, all one needs to do is pronounce the “Shahada”, the testimony of faith, without further delay. The “Shahada” is the first and most important of the five pillars of Islam.

    With the pronunciation of this testimony, or “Shahada”, with sincere belief and conviction, one enters the fold of Islam.

    Upon entering the fold of Islam purely for the Pleasure of God, all of one’s previous sins are forgiven, and one starts a new life of piety and righteousness. The Prophet said to a person who had placed the condition upon the Prophet in accepting Islam that God would forgive his sins:

    “Do you not know that accepting Islam destroys all sins which come before it?” (Saheeh Muslim)

    When one accepts Islam, they in essence repent from the ways and beliefs of their previous life. One need not be overburdened by sins committed before their acceptance. The person’s record is clean, and it is as if he was just born from his mother’s womb. One should try as much as possible to keep his records clean and strive to do as many good deeds as possible.

    The Holy Quran and Hadeeth (prophetic sayings) both stress the importance of following Islam. God states:

    “…The only religion in the sight of God is Islam…” (Quran 3:19)

    In another verse of the Holy Quran, God states:

    “If anyone desires a religion other than Islam, never will it be accepted of him; and in the Hereafter, he will be in the ranks of those who have lost (their selves in the Hellfire).” (Quran 3:85)

    In another saying, Muhammad, the Prophet of God, said:

    “Whoever testifies that there in none worthy of being worshipped but God, Who has no partner, and that Muhammad is His slave and Prophet, and that Jesus is the Slave of God, His Prophet, and His word[1] which He bestowed in Mary and a spirit created from Him; and that Paradise (Heaven) is true, and that the Hellfire is true, God will eventually admit him into Paradise, according to his deeds.” (Saheeh Al-Bukhari)

    The Prophet of God, may God praise him, also reported:

    “Indeed God has forbidden to reside eternally in Hell the person who says: “I testify that none has the right to worship except Allah (God),’ seeking thereby the Face of God.” (Saheeh Al-Bukhari)
    The Declaration of the Testimony (Shahada)

    To convert to Islam and become a Muslim a person needs to pronounce the below testimony with conviction and understanding its meaning:

    I testify “La ilah illa Allah, Muhammad rasoolu Allah.”

    The translation of which is:

    “I testify that there is no true god (deity) but God (Allah), and that Muhammad is a Messenger (Prophet) of God.”

    To hear it click here or click on “Live Help” above for assistance by chat.

    When someone pronounces the testimony with conviction, then he/she has become a Muslim. It can be done alone, but it is much better to be done with an adviser through the “Live Help” at top, so we may help you in pronouncing it right and to provide you with important resources for new Muslims.

    The first part of the testimony consists of the most important truth that God revealed to mankind: that there is nothing divine or worthy of being worshipped except for Almighty God. God states in the Holy Quran:

    “We did not send the Messenger before you without revealing to him: ‘none has the right to be worshipped except I, therefore worship Me.’” (Quran 21:25)

    This conveys that all forms of worship, whether it be praying, fasting, invoking, seeking refuge in, and offering an animal as sacrifice, must be directed to God and to God alone. Directing any form of worship to other than God (whether it be an angel, a messenger, Jesus, Muhammad, a saint, an idol, the sun, the moon, a tree) is seen as a contradiction to the fundamental message of Islam, and it is an unforgivable sin unless it is repented from before one dies. All forms of worship must be directed to God only.

    Worship means the performance of deeds and sayings that please God, things which He commanded or encouraged to be performed, either by direct textual proof or by analogy. Thus, worship is not restricted to the implementation of the five pillars of Islam, but also includes every aspect of life. Providing food for one’s family, and saying something pleasant to cheer a person up are also considered acts of worship, if such is done with the intention of pleasing God. This means that, to be accepted, all acts of worship must be carried out sincerely for the Sake of God alone.

    The second part of the testimony means that Prophet Muhammad is the servant and chosen messenger of God. This implies that one obeys and follows the commands of the Prophet. One must believe in what he has said, practice his teachings and avoid what he has forbidden. One must therefore worship God only according to his teaching alone, for all the teachings of the Prophet were in fact revelations and inspirations conveyed to him by God.

    One must try to mold their lives and character and emulate the Prophet, as he was a living example for humans to follow. God says:

    “And indeed you are upon a high standard of moral character.” (Quran 68:4)

    God also said:

    “And in deed you have a good and upright example in the Messenger of God, for those who hope in the meeting of God and the Hereafter, and mentions God much.” (Quran 33:21)

    He was sent in order to practically implement the Quran, in his saying, deeds, legislation as well as all other facets of life. Aisha, the wife of the Prophet, when asked about the character of the Prophet, replied:

    “His character was that of the Quran.” (As-Suyooti)

    To truly adhere to the second part of the Shahada is to follow his example in all walks of life. God says:

    “Say (O Muhammad to mankind): ‘If you (really) love God, then follow me.’” (Quran 3:31)

    It also means that Muhammad is the Final Prophet and Messenger of God, and that no (true) Prophet can come after him.

    “Muhammad is not the father of any man among you but he is the Messenger of God and the last (end) of the Prophets and God is Ever All-Aware of everything.” (Quran 33:40)

    All who claim to be prophets or receive revelation after Muhammad are imposters, and to acknowledge them would be tantamount to disbelief.

    We welcome you to Islam, congratulate you for your decision, and will try to help you in any way we can.

  14. Sounds like the eldest son has a hidden agenda. Religion is a touchy issue, especially when its Islam we’re talking about, the boundaries of the power of High Court and Syariah Court is extremely blurred, and I doubt the Syariah Court will let the Gan family have their way.

  15. wtf. did someone just spammed you with a random out of topic religious sermon? lmao

  16. LMAO!

  17. There is now another case where an Indian woman cannot inherit the son’s insurance policy because he converted to Islam.

  18. spammer congratulating suan?

  19. Azmeen: hehe my bad :)

    davidlian: well i just wonder what the eldest son’s motives are… if it is the truth that gan’s family are right, then his understanding of his religion must be superficial at least

    dabs: isn’t that so weird though??? i’d be outraged and pissed off if i were a muslim, or in any other case, any other religion.

    fa: i heard the same too :)

    simon: ah well, there you go

    Grant S: hence i wrote “hypothetically” :P but i understand where you are coming from

    moo_T: Got link? i been trying to search but to no avail. regarding the filial piety sutra, i’m not sure if it should fit mahayana? must it be?? mahayana buddhism has roots in confucianism (sp) and chinese cultural brouhaha, and all these states that to go against one’s parents is the greatest evil bla bla. interesting.. i’ll attempt to read more about this

    loisha: eh, welcome to malaysia :D

    doomlord: maybe because the christians trumped them for ages :D hence it’s now revenge time … world domination beckons! bleh

    v0ices: indeed

    SF: if you believe in one in the first place

    jane abraham: thanks for the article. what are YOUR thoughts on it though? in the case of the gan’s family, how would the eldest son know if his father privately converted, having minimal contact with him since he was bed-ridden? by the way, no offense to muslims, but i think that the clean slate after having joined islam is a load of bull. i can think of so many ways that this can be abused.

    leongsoon: i wished high court got more bola

    SF: why the son never changed his policy ? Heh

  20. Mahayana view are beyond filial piety, but towards all living things. The Tao philosophy has many way close to Mahayana Buddhism teaching. OTH, Confucianism are actually counter Buddishm , and strongly reject the it in early year, and view it as a rival.
    The strong Mahayana that taken road are none other than teaching brought Bodhidharma, that start the Chán(or Zen) school. Platform Sutra of the Sixth Patriarch are the first Buddhist scripture from China.

  21. Notty Gurl says:

    GOD IS GREAT…

    For whatever reason(s) the eldest son did what he did, GOD is watching and irrespective of which GOD we are talking about, no GOD rejoice in such lies and dirty tactics. So, for the eldest son, be warned… tricks and lies are actions that GOD despise and will be “rewarded” accordingly. Yes, even if you appear to be doing something to glorify GOD…

    As for the family, the situation in Malaysia is such and really, what are your chances of getting a fair judgement? At the end of the day, does it really matter where and how the father was buried? A person is always remembered and cherished in the heart and not by the grave the person is buried in. So, my advise to the family is TRUST IN GOD as GOD IS FAIR AND JUST. Nothing escapes GOD’s eyes lor… Whatever justice we cannot get from our human, man made law, we are guarantee to get from GOD lor. So, hang in there… remember your dear old dad in your heart… the body is afterall a shell now and where it is buried is insignificant.

    As for distribution of assets, well, if the eldest is greedy enough to use such dirty tactics, give it to him.. I believe that ill gotten gains will never last and using such gains will always result in horrible endings… Sigh..

  22. Notty Gurl says:

    Suanie ah…

    Re your comment about you wishing High Court got more bola… Wahahaha!!! High Court, low court.. whatever court la.. it is a circus already with that lingam sauce story! Wahaha.. some more 1 2 have bola meh… BOLA DAH KECUT! Wahahaha….

  23. Yea, more balls would be nice. It’s contradictory and self-defeating to have Syariah Court be as powerful as High Court when we are a supposedly “secular” nation. I say supposedly because this is highly debatable too. And bollocks to whoever decided that the court shall rule over how a man is buried upon his death, just leave the decision to his family members who have been with him throughout the remains of his life; this might not be totally correct, but they should know what he wanted best.

  24. from what i understand… the wealth and properties of a muslim can only be distributed to another muslim.

  25. i feel sick in my tummy after reading the post and the comments. this kind of things just shouldn’t happen.

  26. Moses never met any Muslim!

  27. Hem.. This is not the first time i’m hearing about this..

    But, it is true.. Our constitution states that, no law is above the syriah law, and no one is above the constitution..and so, we cant do anything…

    If i were the sibling of the eldest son, I would just shoot the crap out of him..

  28. If its really true that he converted, he should be burried the islamic way. If he isnt, then he should be left and let the family takeover.

    While the fight goes on and on, the body is deforming and releasing a very foul smell. What ever it is, bury or burn, just do it ASAP. dont let it be in the open air for too long.

    PS: Got story of Nabi Musa somemore!

  29. don’t hate the religion. hate the incompetent dumbasses who are supposed to work FOR the religion.

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